TF7700HDPVR Q&A in English

[Top4]

Hello, I would like to start this thread where we can speak (write and read) in English. Hope this is accepted. I have now got my box up and running and have some questions:

#1 If I select multiple files in the File List and press the Rec-button to start unscramble the files, nothing happend. Shouldn't this be possible?

#2 I have tested to play some rec files from the USB device, but the box complain about the format. Even for rec files from the unit it self (only the rec file, not the other 3 files). Is it possible to play back any rec file, or is it not implemented yet?
I would like to play rec files from TF5000PVRt, TF5510PVR and also raw ts files.
(I notice that the rec file from TF7700HDPVR is actually a raw TS file)

#3 I have a Conax CAM and card. It only descramble one service at a time. I would like it to descramble two at the same time, live and a recording. Is this possible with another CAM? I have a Conax 4.00e CAM from SCM Microsystems (P/N 904180 R1.0).

#4 Is it possible to buy only remote controls from Topfield? I don't like the one that was included. I would prefered the remote control that is draw in the User Guide.

Best regards

[mapro]

@3:
I've seen this feature in another pvr, but it was obligatory there to enable this in the receivers system setup (was called 'dual descramble mode'). So I am quite sure, that it has to be supported by the pvr - not only by the CAM, which is - afaik - not implemented in the current firmware of the TF7700.

@4:
There are several German online-shops selling the silver remote control separately at about 50 Euros.

Greets, mapro

[ToppiUser]

@1:
The red button only select files for playback, but it's not possible to descramble more than one file at once with selcect/playback and record. If you can read in german, exactly this question was discussed in an other thread one or two days before. -> klick me

@2: It's no problem to playback files from USB recorded with and copied from the TF7700HD PVR, but i'm not shure if it's possible, to playback files, recorded with an other PVR, like the TF-5000PvrT/ TF-5100PVR-T or TF-7700HD PVR rec-files without the other 3 small files.

[adelrania]

dear all

yes, we need an english section to discuss, please moderators make that section.

yours, Adel

[Top4]

Hallo, I'm back...

I can not play/descramble old recordings. It's seems like it can not learn the smartcard with the old keys. It will play the recording faster than normal (with black picture). Using a Conax CAM and Swedish Canal Digital card. No problem to play/descramble (copy) recording shortly after recording.

Is it only me, or is it a fatal bug in the box?

PS. Using the last firmware.

[Equinox]

[quote=""Top4""]Hallo, I'm back...

I can not play/descramble old recordings. It's seems like it can not learn the smartcard with the old keys. It will play the recording faster than normal (with black picture). Using a Conax CAM and Swedish Canal Digital card. No problem to play/descramble (copy) recording shortly after recording.

Is it only me, or is it a fatal bug in the box?

PS. Using the last firmware.[/quote]
None of the above. It's general problem with pay-per-view that you cannot playback scrambled recordings after the key for the smartcard has changed. The only solution is to descramble all recordings shortly after recording.

[Top4]

Sorry, it's about normal watch. Not pay-per-view.

[Equinox]

[quote=""Top4""]Sorry, it's about normal watch. Not pay-per-view.[/quote]
I don't know anything about Swedish TV, but actually, it doesn't make a difference whether the broadcast is encrypted because of commercial or legal reasons.
The problem still stays the same: if I got you right, you need a smartcard to watch those channels and as soon as this smartcard's key changes, you are not able to playback encrypted recordings any more. This is the same problem as we have it in Germany with pay per view, and by now, the only solution is to descramble the recordings as soon as possible.
Hopefully, the 7700HDPVR will support multichannel decryption some day, so that there are no more encrypted recordings any more.

[Top4]

Well I don't know how it works with the system used in German. So what I say might not be correct for your system. However...

The correct keys are needed to descramble the stream, live or playback (if not descrambled at recording). Several keys are used for different groups channels, but don't concern about that now. However the keys are changed during time, decided by the operator. Let us say that they change keys for every month. I record in january, not descrambled. Possible to watch it for all of that month and also next month if the keys still are in the smartcard. During January the operator sends out the new key for the next month, so the smartcard can learn (save) it. At start of february they switch to the new key. However the smartcard have limited space for keys, so they must reuse the location for older keys. Here the Swedish Canal Digital is reusing the old key space very quickly, only after a few days. This make it hard for the users. They did not do so several years ago, when the keys there available longer period of time.

If an old recording that uses the old key are played and the old key are still available in the smartcard. There will be no problem.

If an old recording are played the CA (conditional access) information are sent to the CAM/snartcard. The same as for live watching, with the exception that the information are old (the time for the recording). So if an old-old recording are played the old key will be learned/loaded into the smartcard. When the complete key have been loaded the video/audio will appear. Now is it possible to re-start the play from the begining and watch the complete movie.

If you watch a recording the current key (for live) might be overwritten with an old key. So after play it might be impossible to watch live. Very sad, I have learned this the hard way! You need to wait for the smartcard to learn the new current key, might take 20 minutes or more.

One trick the box can do while playing an old recording and needed to learn an old key. Is to play it faster so the learning process goes quicker. An old firmware to TF4000PVRCoCI did this, but not the latest.

For the terrestial in Sweden, this is better. The old keys (or maybe they don't chenge keys) are available on the smartcard for over one year.

Of course the 7700HD must handle this, as other Toppys can.

PS. I have a Topfield TF4000PVRCoCI and have had it for six years, the latest years with a CAM. Long time experiance.

[Equinox]

Thank you for the detailed explanation.
I'm not sure if the German pay-per-view cards do save keys at all, but at the moment, it wouldn't make a big difference, since Premiere (the pay tv provider) keeps changing keys very often. It is said that they will roll out a new encryption system in April so that keys don't have to be changed that often - hopefully, this is true, because it's very annoying if you can't playback recordings that are less than a week old.

But anyway, Topfield has to do something about the way, the 7700HDPVR handles envrypted broadcasts. Multichannel decryption is supported by the CAMs that we use for Premiere, so why can't the HDPVR use it?

Cheers!

[Top4]

[quote=""Equinox""]Multichannel decryption is supported by the CAMs that we use for Premiere, so why can't the HDPVR use it?[/quote]
Hopefully they will implement it, since TF6000PVR can handle it (atleast according to the manual). The chip used in TF7700HDPVR for the CI (CAM slots) can handle two simultaneously streams.

PS. I would like to see a version of the box with Conax embedded and with multi (4) descrambling (live, pip and two recordings).

[Top4]

Have now also tested with the 7.00.20 firmware, same problem.

I also did another test. I played an old recording in my old box, so the smartcard get old information. Not possible to watch live. I moved the smartcard (and CAM) to the 7700HD box. No picture, but after approx. 15 minutes it appear. So it seems like the smartcard get updated at live watch.

[flemlion]

My 7700HDPVR hasn't been able to decrypt recorded files so far. And that's with firmwares from .13 up to .19 and that is irrespective of the time between recording and viewing.

If the icon next to the recording is completely blue (meaning encrypted) I can just delete it, because there's nothing to see. With a mixed icon, part of the recording might be viewable, it just depends how big a part has been decrypted.

This is further complicated by the fact that the box doesn't seem to be able to do a decrypted recording when a channel is recorded in the background. The channel that is visible will in general be decrypted (and recorded as such) properly, but not if the recording happens in the background. And that is irrespective of the fact if the foreground channel is encrypted or not.

One very rare occasion with the .13 firmware I did get two simultaneous recordings that were both recorded decrypted, but that seems to be a freak 'accident', since I've been unable to reproduce this. Neither with that firmware, nor any since.
This is frustrating since it seems to point to the fact that it should be possible to do that.

Another thing that has made matters worse is that the .19 firmware now sometimes starts a recording in the background, instead of the earlier versions always switching a recording to the foreground.
If it properly records in the background, I have no problem with this. But as long as this bug exists, at least I would like to be able to configure the recording as foreground or background. Maybe by just introducing a change to the first parameter of a timer entry: have Recording option: Off/Fore/Back instead of just the On/Off that's there now.

[Top4]

[quote=""flemlion""]Another thing that has made matters worse is that the .19 firmware now sometimes starts a recording in the background, instead of the earlier versions always switching a recording to the foreground.
If it properly records in the background, I have no problem with this. But as long as this bug exists, at least I would like to be able to configure the recording as foreground or background. Maybe by just introducing a change to the first parameter of a timer entry: have Recording option: Off/Fore/Back instead of just the On/Off that's there now.[/quote]
They have fixed the bug that the box switched channel at recording, when it should not. Maybe this is what you see. You need to keep in mind which tuner you are watching and which tuner you set the recording to. Watch tuner1 and record tuner2 => recording in background.m So if you always want foreground recording, watch and record on the same tuner.

One drawback with this is that the end-user need to handle the tuner selection. I think this is good, or else the box probable should have more bugs regarding this. On the other hand if the box should handle the tuner selection, some things would be impossible todo. One example is the choice for me to decide if the box should switch to the recording channel or do a background recording while I watching a program.

PS. I haven't test all possible cases, but I hope the bug is gone and the box do as it should do.

[adelrania]

hi all

this receiver have great capabilities and need alt software ( patch ) so that we can enjoy it, do any one have any idea ??

yours

Adel

[Top4]

Hi

I have 3 major problems:

1) Sound dropouts. On one channel the sound makes small/short breaks, part of a second. I can see that the signal disappear for the applifier. This occur maybe twenty times in one hour. Sometimes several minutes between, but some times 3 times within one minute. It only occur on the channel "SVT HD" (Thor), a HD 720p channel with dolby digital (AC-3) 5.1 sound. The normal stereo sound is ok. One funny thing is that if I record the event and watch it (playback) the dropouts is very few. One time (1 hour event) actually no dropouts at all.

2) DVB subtitle does not work. On the channels (five HD channels) I have that are using DVB subtitle, it does not work. No subtitle shows up. Please note this is for DVB-subtitle, not the teletext based. In the menu there it is possible to select current language/subtitle, the string "DVB" is written in front of the language code, e.g. "DVB[swe]".

3) Smelly. When the box get hot it's smell awful. It's seems to be the big transformer on the power supply board. I run without the top cover, so it don't get so hot. The smell seems to be long lasting. I have had the box run for several days in another room, many times. Is it possible to repair or exchange the power supply board?

[toddel68]

[quote="Top4"]

3) Smelly. When the box get hot it's smell awful. It's seems to be the big transformer on the power supply board. I run without the top cover, so it don't get so hot. The smell seems to be long lasting. I have had the box run for several days in another room, many times. Is it possible to repair or exchange the power supply board?[/quote]


This is 'normal' and was reported by many users. However, the smell should cease after about two weeks of regular usage.

Thorsten

[freezz10]

Hello all,

I bought a new TF7710HDPVR a few months ago and I am having a few problems and I wish you guys can help me:

1- When I first got my receiver I plugged it in and started playing around with it, I checked on the video format button on the remote control to change the display setting to see if the 1080p resolution will be displayed and it did. I then upgraded my firmware to the newest one and after that I lost the ability to change between the different video setting, when I press the button on the remote control its only set on the lowest setting 576 I think and its grayed out so I cant change the video settings anymore. I emailed Topfield and they told me to wait for the new firmware. I now installed the 27-Mar firmware and I still have the same problem I can’t change between the different video resolutions.
2- The network setting don’t work I plug in a network cable and the receiver does not recognize that there is internet.

I hope you guys can help I tired emailing Topfield and with no luck.

[Top4]

1- Maybe the switch on the rear side have changed, unintentional. If it's in the SCART position, only 576 is available.

PS. I have never changed resolution via the remote. I put the unit in one of the auto mode and it change according to the transmitted resolution.

[freezz10]

1- Maybe the switch on the rear side have changed, unintentional. If it's in the SCART position, only 576 is available.

PS. I have never changed resolution via the remote. I put the unit in one of the auto mode and it change according to the transmitted resolution.

Thank you very much, you are right the switch was changed!!! now i have auto again

now i need the network to work, but a quick question pls; the network cable plugged in the unit is only for firmware upgrade? is there a way to hook up the receiver to my home network via the ethernet cable?